I remember when I was young, I felt that if I could just be in high school, life would just make sense. I could not wait to be one of the "big kids". Once in high school, I learned that it wasn't what it was cut out to be.
I began to wrestle with the idea that college would be this promised land. I knew that once I started college that the stars would just line up. Life was going to be what it was meant to be, once I entered into college. But guess what? I went into college, and as great as it was, there was still an itch for the future.
I then moved on to my new hope for the good life in finding a girl that would put up with me. I met that girl too. I met Meghan Delargy and we are married now. We have experienced many ups and downs. I can certainly say that my life is very blessed being in a relationship to the woman I am married to. She is nothing but wonderful and great. Here is the kick, I still find myself eager for the future so that I can find fulfillment.
There are houses to purchase, more kids to have, more money to be made, being debt free, finding new music that speaks to me, promotions to be had, more Wii games to play, more books to read, going on vacations every year, traveling the world, and the list just goes on and on. It amazes me that I tell myself over and over that tomorrow will be better only if i can.... (fill in in the blank). It all just seems like those hamsters that run on the wheel, the faster they run, the faster the wheel goes, and the hamster still goes no where.
I am learning that I need to live for today. And this is where the church can come in and make changes. The church presents a message of Jesus that exemplifies this message. It is all about heaven, and until then, just try to be moral and good little Christians. That is the 'hamster wheel hope'. I wonder what it means to have an every day hope. What would a church look like if a church carried this 'everyday hope' out to the world? I believe this to be questions that we need to start asking. We have no promises for tomorrow and how it will go. Let us live for today and see realize that today can be as good as any other day. Will tomorrow always be better? The answer may be yes, if we continue to live within that mindset. I am reminded by U2's song Stuck in a Moment, here are the lyrics;
I'm not afraid
Of anything in this world
There's nothing you can throw at me
That I haven't already heard
I'm just trying to find
A decent melody
A song that I can sing
In my own company
I never thought you were a fool
But darling, look at you.
Ooh.You gotta stand up straight,
carry your own weight 'Cause tears are going
nowhere baby
You've got to get yourself together
You've got stuck in a moment
And now you can't get out of it
Don't say that later will be better
Now you're stuck in a moment
And you can't get out of it
I will not forsake
The colors that you bring
The nights you filled with fireworks
They left you with nothing
I am still enchanted
By the light you brought to me
I listen through your ears
Through your eyes I can see
You are such a fool
To worry like you do.. Oh I know it's tough
And you can never get enough
Of what you don't really need now
My, oh my
You've got to get yourself together
You've got stuck in a moment
And you can't get out of it
Oh love, look at you now
You've got yourself stuck in a moment
And you can't get out of it
Oh lord look at you now
You've got yourself stuck in a moment
And you cant get out of it
I was unconscious, half asleep
The water is warm 'til you discover how deep
I wasn't jumping, for me it was a fall
It's a long way down to nothing at all
You've got to get yourself together
You've got stuck in a moment
And you can't get out of it
Don't say that later will be better
Now you're stuck in a moment
And you can't get out of it
And if the night runs over
And if the day won't last
And if your way should falter
Along this stony pass
It's just a moment
This time will pass
-DJ
http://audaciousliturgy.blogspot.com/
Monday, April 13, 2009
Tuesday, April 7, 2009
Thoughts on "Transformational Architecture" by Ron Martoia; "The Biblical Text"
In an effort to continue my review of "Transformational Architecture" by Ron Martoia, I wanted to present the next portion of my thoughts on Martoia's second text titled "the Biblical Text". This is one of the most fascinating parts of the book. Martoia basically says that in order to effectively share God with others it is important to examine the Biblical narrative that we reference.Martoia explains that Christians have always presented at least a portion of the "Biblical Text".
"Most Christians...know an abbreviated CliffNotes version of the biblical story. It is important to realize this, because it is precisely a miscue at the story level that causes a nearly complete failure at the spiritual conversation level." (Page 51)Is it possible that Christians have been telling just a portion of whats important in God's story? Are we willing to question this at all? At the core of this question is an evaluation of our humility. If there is any possibility that we have might of gotten it wrong, is it possible that we can become to prideful to move in another direction? I think this is a question that Martoia forces us to ask ourselves.
There are two directions you can go with this question. The first is to embrace the possibility to see if we are in any need of repentance. The second is to embrace a prideful mindset, and go into this with no willingness to engage in any form of doubt. The second possibility is a mistake, and I truly believe truth will not change in the environment of doubt. With this being said the traditional story as Martoia explains goes something like this;
"'...you are broken, messed up, heading to hell---and you need to fix it.' The story continues: Jesus has come and lived a perfect life, so that when he died, he could die the death you should have died. If you will trust him and his death, you can now live the life he lives and someday have a seat forever with him in eternity."- (Page 51)This message sounds awfully familiar to me in my tradition, as it probably does in many traditional evangelical circles. So to question the message can be a tough one to embrace. At the same time, I wonder if we have missed something as Martoia suggests. Are we using the watered down gospel? If this isn't the full story then what is it? Martoia does explain this, but not in totality within this chapter, Martoia does offer this though,
"Here is the rub: Did Jesus go around offering the propositional distillation...?Was this what constituted following him? Jesus, it seems, had a fundamentally different mission. He wanted to broker shalom. Jesus was interested in imparting wholeness to people, and while eternity in fellowship with him is in fact a part of that wholeness, it wasn't a primary part of the conversation he had with people" (Page 55)
This is a message that I can follow, and not just believe. And that is exactly what the problem is in just telling part of the story. It becomes tempting to limit faith just to belief. But, the Jesus message invites us into mission and movement. It is a call to partner with God and His desires for an abundant life for all. Is it possible that when we offer the CliffNotes version of the story we miss this central theme. I think it is very possible and Martoia is right in pointing this out.
Martoia uses Luke 4:16-21 to point to a possible "mission statement" of Jesus. If you read the passage, does it at all resemble our mission within most churches? Martoia rightly points out that we will "spiritualize" portions of this text to make it fit with our belief. Does the text allow this freedom? It is is a tough argument to say 'That's not what Jesus meant...he really meant this...'.
Martoia ends with thoughts on our modern approach to scriptures. He says this about that approach,
"We have been co-opted by the same game rules of the modern world and we have reduced the Bible to a set of propositional principals to apply. We even call it 'owners manual for life'." (Page 61)
This happens too often in church circles. If we string enough random verses to prove a point, we then win people to Christ. At least that is what we tell ourselves. I think that we intimidate others in our attempts to throw verses at others. I have known others in which this proved to be more harm then good. What is the alternative though? Is there a better way?
"When we understand the entire story, starting with creation rather then the fall, we start with God's intended purposes for the world. When we start with creation, we start with the very reason we exist and the basis of our yearnings. When we understand creation, we have a clear picture of what the whole world is headed back toward as all things are ultimately restored in Jesus. " (Page 66)
The central concept that Martoia is saying that we should embrace is the narrative. To see the biblical text as it was intended, and that is an ongoing story, as Martoia calls it "meta-narrative". In order to do that, we should not start off with the "sin problem" as we often do. Instead we must look at the beginning of our story in creation. This is where we will find our purpose within the story. Martoia will pick this up further in the book.
It is a challenge to ask ourselves if we are sharing the full message of God. I personally do believe that Martoia is on to something when he suggests that we are leaving out very important aspects of the story. I believe that embracing the message as a narrative we have room for a true sharing experience with our friends. By embracing narrative, we can plug ourselves in this ongoing story that is still being written. I would rather invite someone in this ongoing story, and invite them to participate in this partnership with God, rather then convincing them to believe a set of propositional truths. The only question becomes, is this a narrative that the church can embrace?
-dj
http://audaciousliturgy.blogspot.com/
Finding God in Unusual Places; "Everyday Sacredness"
My wife is fixated on purchasing a legitimate camera. I first saw her passion for taking pictures and in capturing this world through a lens, when our friends Joe and Monica had a Nikeon. Every time we would go visit them, my wife would take the Nikeon and shoot everything in sight. While taking pictures with this camera, I could not help nut notice the glow and her obvious enjoyment she received in doing so.
I have finally gave my wife the "go ahead" in purchasing the camera. We are just waiting on gathering the necessary funds to make the purchase. In her excitement of the "go ahead" from me, we began to talk about her growing passion of picture taking. The conversation went something like this;
I have finally gave my wife the "go ahead" in purchasing the camera. We are just waiting on gathering the necessary funds to make the purchase. In her excitement of the "go ahead" from me, we began to talk about her growing passion of picture taking. The conversation went something like this;
Me: So...why do you like taking pictures anyway?
Meghan: I don't know, I have to think about that...
Me: I guess before we just throw a substantial amount of money toward a camera, I would like to understand why this is something that you want to pursue.
Meghan: Well... I guess I love the challenge of capturing, the sometimes fleeting, beauty in a still form.
Me: Fair enough, that sounds like a God thing. What do you think?
Meghan: Oh, here we go...You can't stop doing that can you? Ya know, the whole 'everything going back to God' thing...(I must admit this is a familiar tangent that I often go on, but Meghan loves it...at least I think she does.)
Me: Now hear me out, I think it is a God thing, there is beauty all around us all the time, but it is so easy to get caught up in the ugliness of it all, and forget about beauty. I think its cool that you want to capture that, and maybe refer to that, when things get ugly. Is this true or am I just looking to hard at this?
Meghan: Nahh, in all seriousness I think there is truth to that. But taking pictures isn't just about the capturing of beauty for me. It is sorta like...um, kind of like meditation. There is something about it that calms me, it brings a new pace and rhythm to my life.
Me: Really, now that is interesting! Its kind of like a discipline then. You find yourself drawn closer to God when you take pictures. Some people find quite places to think, pray, and to just slow life down. But, you take pictures. That is interesting!
Meghan: I guess you can say that. Buy why is that so interesting.
Me: Well I was reading the book, and the name of the book slips me right now, but the author suggested to allow the everyday events to become sacred. Instead of adding more and more "disciplines", just allow what you already love to do to be Holy. This author enjoyed brewing coffee and he talked about how he allowed God to show up in this brewing process. It was rather fascinating.
Me: And I think that's what it sounds like you are doing when you take pictures. You are allowing God to show up in something that you already love to do.
Meghan: Sounds good to me, its your turn to take the boy out of the car, I did it last time.
(I think this was a hint to move one, so that's what I did.)
This conversation is so important today. Many think that religion is nothing more then a "to-do" list, and there is substantial guilt for you, if you are unable to meet this list. But what if we could begin to find God in what we already love to do.? Instead of filling our lives with more and more "stuff", what if our "stuff" became sacred? And here is a crazy thought, what if God doesn't want you to snooze through a traditional discipline, but He loves us so much that He is willing to unveil Himself in what we already find interesting. Isn't this what we find in Jesus? Instead of barking orders from "way up there" God expressed His love for His Creation by showing up in our world.
This conversation is so important today. Many think that religion is nothing more then a "to-do" list, and there is substantial guilt for you, if you are unable to meet this list. But what if we could begin to find God in what we already love to do.? Instead of filling our lives with more and more "stuff", what if our "stuff" became sacred? And here is a crazy thought, what if God doesn't want you to snooze through a traditional discipline, but He loves us so much that He is willing to unveil Himself in what we already find interesting. Isn't this what we find in Jesus? Instead of barking orders from "way up there" God expressed His love for His Creation by showing up in our world.
This is not to say that prayer, fasting, and the study of scripture is not important. But if we can hand the keys over to God in our passions and let Him make those passions sacred, maybe we will find our relationship with God in a place where it never has been.
-dj
http://audaciousliturgy.blogspot.com/
Sunday, March 29, 2009
Thoughts on "Transformational Architecture" by Ron Martoia; "The Context"

A key component in sharing Jesus with our new postmodern world is to understand what Ron Martoia explains as being "the three texts". In this particular post I will be summarizing the first text that Martoia presents, and I will offer some thoughts on this text as well. The first texts that Martoia explains as being a part of any conversations is "the context".
"The Context"
Martoia explains "the context" in this way, "...is everything from geography to culture....This text is important to understand because it provides the 'container' in which everything in life transpires." (Page 19)
This is where you first meet "Chad". Chad will be introduced in this chapter and will be followed up on through out the remaining of the book. Chad is presented as one that has spiritual questions and thoughts, and Ron Martoia is his partner in crime. Throughout the book they have very lively and intriguing discussions. This conversational tone is used as the vehicle to present "the context". Chad brings up something called the "axial age" The "axial age" is explained like this;
This is where you first meet "Chad". Chad will be introduced in this chapter and will be followed up on through out the remaining of the book. Chad is presented as one that has spiritual questions and thoughts, and Ron Martoia is his partner in crime. Throughout the book they have very lively and intriguing discussions. This conversational tone is used as the vehicle to present "the context". Chad brings up something called the "axial age" The "axial age" is explained like this;
"The axial age was the time period between 800 and 200 BC when some key religious figures and movements were born in China, India, the Middle East, and certain places in the west--movements that still nourish many of the spiritual traditions of our day." (Page 22)
This axial age is talked about extensively between Ron Martoia and "Chad". One of the ideas that emerges from this conversation is the idea that we might be in the middle of another axial age today. A driven point that leads to this new axial age is the idea that the original axial age emerged as a deeper connection to humanity outside of violence, and this next axial age emerges from globalization.
This axial age brings some good points, and it can be fairly though provoking. However, if we just focus on this axial age that is discussed, I believe that we will miss the point of this whole discussion. What I believe Martoia is saying is that we need to listen to our spiritual friends. "Chad" is the one presenting such discussions and Ron allows "Chad" to steer the discussion while Ron is attempting to actively listen.
Herein lies "the context" in which Martoia argues that we as followers of Jesus need to not only be aware of, but we need to to be empathetic to as well. As Chad references popular spiritual books, musicians that talk about Jesus, and other outlets that our expressing various thoughts on spirituality, Martoia used these expressions as a launching pad for an engagement of conversation where he tried to express himself as an active listener.
"My guess is that the world has lots of Chads. Lots of people are trying to figure out if Christianity can handle their toughest questions, their random musings, and their deepest doubts. "
To sum up Martoia's work in this chapter, we need to realize "the context" as a a very important consideration when talking to friends about spiritual items. "The context" is where human history has been, where is is now, and where it is going. Whether that being the context of globalization, war, or a new "axis", and understanding of our movement as a humanity is crucial.
Now, here is my admission. I promised to do this in a 3 post outline. I don't think this will happen, I will spend two more posts on the remainder of the texts, then hopefully two more posts from there. I would rather cover all the areas in which I believe to be important so I can do my due diligence.
-dj
http://audaciousliturgy.blogspot.com/
Monday, March 23, 2009
Finding God in Unusual Places; Uncertainty
When I began this series of posting about finding God in unusual places, the idea was to be open to the possibility that God dwells in places that sometimes we may overlook or not recognize. By doing this, we will begin to actually become more aware of our environment, so that we may see a glimpse God.
This can create some confusion though, when we are making a great effort in looking for God, but we simply cannot find Him.
Does this mean I am not looking hard enough? Is there something that is preventing me from seeing Him in these situations.?
I wonder if we can find God in these situations, maybe in a different context. Is it possible one of the unusual places that we find God is in the realm of uncertainty.
I have to think it is.
The wife and I have been married for 3 years now. Does this mean that we never fight, or have disagreements? Does this mean that we always have "lovey-dovey's" when we wake up next to each other. As much as I want to say this is true, it simply isn't. What keeps us going though, is our ability to understand that we have a committed future. That commitment is the hope that we find in uncertain waters.
Whether it is walking on water, loosing a job, or even just a day where it just seems like we cant even glimpse a passing of the Spirit, I wonder if we can still find God in the unusual context of uncertainty. I think it will go a long way to reevaluate our commitments and to trust the relationship God extends to us. We can always look back and see that this context tends to work itself out, so let us find God in uncertainty through the hope of God's commitment to us. Let these times serve as a sign post to our relationship with God, even when things seem a little cloudy.
-dj
http://audaciousliturgy.blogspot.com/
This can create some confusion though, when we are making a great effort in looking for God, but we simply cannot find Him.
Does this mean I am not looking hard enough? Is there something that is preventing me from seeing Him in these situations.?
I wonder if we can find God in these situations, maybe in a different context. Is it possible one of the unusual places that we find God is in the realm of uncertainty.
I have to think it is.
The wife and I have been married for 3 years now. Does this mean that we never fight, or have disagreements? Does this mean that we always have "lovey-dovey's" when we wake up next to each other. As much as I want to say this is true, it simply isn't. What keeps us going though, is our ability to understand that we have a committed future. That commitment is the hope that we find in uncertain waters.
Whether it is walking on water, loosing a job, or even just a day where it just seems like we cant even glimpse a passing of the Spirit, I wonder if we can still find God in the unusual context of uncertainty. I think it will go a long way to reevaluate our commitments and to trust the relationship God extends to us. We can always look back and see that this context tends to work itself out, so let us find God in uncertainty through the hope of God's commitment to us. Let these times serve as a sign post to our relationship with God, even when things seem a little cloudy.
-dj
http://audaciousliturgy.blogspot.com/
Saturday, March 14, 2009
Thoughts on "Transformational Architecture" by Ron Martoia; Introduction
As I set down to gather my thoughts to review of "Transformational Architecture" by Ron Martoia, I began to realize that this was going to be more of a process then any book that I have offered my thoughts on previously. Why? The material here is too thought provoking and, to use a word offered in the title, too transformational. A couple paragraphs just would not be suffice, and I feel that it would not provide a true picture of how I feel about Martoia's work here. Let there be no misunderstanding, this is one of the more important books that I have read in quite some time. So what I want to do, is break the book up in its natural parts, and as I do this, I want to offer a few items.The first item that I would like to provide is just a summarizing of the offering of each part by Martoia . I want to do this, because there is just so much in here, I find it would be most fair to allow the cream of the crop be present in my review. I also want the review to reflect the flow and the way Martoia presents his take on the essential narrative.
The second item that I would like to offer in my review is my thoughts and reflections of each part. I realize that my thoughts will play second fiddle to the incredible material that I plan on summarizing, but what is a review without the reviewers thoughts? I hope to add any insight or to just reaffirm items of importance.
The review in totality will be broken up in 3 additional posts from this one. The next post will reflect on Martoia's thoughts on the "3 Texts". The 2nd and 3rd posts will reflect the remainder of the book (which is not broken down like this by Martoia, however there is a lot of ground to cover so I will).
Let me end by proving the premise of "Transformational Architecture", as laid out by Ron Martoia in the "Introduction".
"If you are a follower of Jesus, if you take his motivational charge in Matthew 28 seriously, if you love him and what he has done with your life, then it is a natural overflow to want to share it with others. The question is How?" (Pg 11.)
Isn't this a question that we all have had, especially in our new postmodern context that we have found ourselves in? I personally resonate with a frustration when wanting to share this amazing Jesus. I have found that old methodology of handing out tracts and relaying apologetics have not worked either. So when Martoia asks this question, I found myself eager to see what Martoia purposes as a hope, in an effort that I make in sharing Jesus with others.
Martoia explains that not only our methodology needs to be examined but our message does to. This is the crux of the remaining of the book, and that is the message that we relay to others. But I am getting ahead, because there will be much more of this later. First, Martoia essentially sets out to explain the reasoning of the title of the book;
"... I find that people are genuinely interested in spiritual conversations. Why? God's original architecture plans for human 'heart space' is designed us with cravings, longings, yearnings, that sit at the intuitive level of our lives." (Pg 12.)
Do I agree with this? I think so. I find that some of my closest friends outside of any affirmative discipleship have the same spiritual cravings as I do. It only seems natural to allow this to be a starting point in spiritual conversations, and to some degree, I have experienced this. Martoia further explains his use of Architecture;
"....architecture emerges from a couple of different associations...(it)can be about buildings and design....But architecture can also be seen through the lens of software and computer design." (Pg 16)
Martoia further explains that computers have several levels of different communications with different operating systems. All of this communication is happening at the same time, so that the computer may fully operate to its fullest potential. He explains that "...this structure is referred to as the software's architecture."
Herein is the premise of what Martoia will be presenting, "We have been specifically built- architected- with core deign elements that cause us to crave transformation." (Pg. 17) Are we called to listen to this cravings? First we must decide if that there is this underling yearning, and if so, we must faithfully listen.
I think Martoia's presentation of his premise works, but it pales in comparison to the journey that he takes you on in the remainder of the book. That being said, its just the introduction, there is a reason why you keep reading further.
This, I hope you will do some time in the future. But in the mean time, stay tuned for the remainder of the review, the next portion will be coming in the near future. As I said before, I will be covering Martoia's presentation of the "3 Texts".
-dj
http://audaciousliturgy.blogspot.com/
Monday, March 9, 2009
My Facebook Status/Question on the Cheapness of Taco Bell and the Quest for Truth
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Facebook is becoming a world of its own. It is truly amazing how Facebook has evolved into one of the premier networking sites. It really feels like my own little kingdom, with my own little friends that have decided to be in my kingdom. It is even more amazing in how I have convinced myself , that updating my Facebook status via twitter really matters to those that have decided to reside in this kingdom. I can just imagine that my "friends list" reaches a complete halt in what they are doing, in their anticipation of my status update. I still have not mastered the art of the update, however I choose to do so often anyways.
The other day I decided to relay a question/thought via Facebook status. I had just gone to Taco Bell, and it prompted a thought process that I felt the urgency to be shared. I absolutely love Taco Bell. There is a satisfaction that I receive in knowing that I can eat so cheaply and enjoy the process, at least for the most part. But there is still one lingering question that I decided to pose on Facebook, in the form that is only acceptable on Facebook, third person that is.
Here is the question:
"Dan is wondering how Taco Bell can make their product so cheap?"
I think its a fair question!
Here is one of the response I got from the question I posed:
"don't look into it any further. it will ruin that great feeling you get from such a cheap lunch..."
You cannot eat as cheap if you were to go to a grocery store and purchase all the necessary ingredients. With that it mind, you can leave Taco Bell spending $2.45. (Assuming you don't purchase a drink.) There is something about that fact that I am just completely amazed.
However, I was advised not to go any further with that discussion. In essence, I was told it would bring no good.
Someone else responded to my status saying this:
"That question is to never be answered. For your own good you should stop wondering."
I hit a brick wall in my quest for truth. I figure that this advice was good advice. I do want to keep my satisfaction with my lunch. And based on the responses, it looks like it isn't a good idea to always know everything.
The other day I decided to relay a question/thought via Facebook status. I had just gone to Taco Bell, and it prompted a thought process that I felt the urgency to be shared. I absolutely love Taco Bell. There is a satisfaction that I receive in knowing that I can eat so cheaply and enjoy the process, at least for the most part. But there is still one lingering question that I decided to pose on Facebook, in the form that is only acceptable on Facebook, third person that is.
Here is the question:
"Dan is wondering how Taco Bell can make their product so cheap?"
I think its a fair question!
Here is one of the response I got from the question I posed:
"don't look into it any further. it will ruin that great feeling you get from such a cheap lunch..."
You cannot eat as cheap if you were to go to a grocery store and purchase all the necessary ingredients. With that it mind, you can leave Taco Bell spending $2.45. (Assuming you don't purchase a drink.) There is something about that fact that I am just completely amazed.
However, I was advised not to go any further with that discussion. In essence, I was told it would bring no good.
Someone else responded to my status saying this:
"That question is to never be answered. For your own good you should stop wondering."
I hit a brick wall in my quest for truth. I figure that this advice was good advice. I do want to keep my satisfaction with my lunch. And based on the responses, it looks like it isn't a good idea to always know everything.
My peers' influence had steered me away from truly searching for answers. In this case, I cannot blame them, and I am happy to set aside this quest. However I wonder if our search for truth can be influenced by others in such ways as my Taco Bell question.
I have questions, and lots of them. They are tough questions too! When I find the courage to pose them in certain environments, I receive similar responses that I got with the Taco Bell question. Sure, churches say that questions are welcomed and appreciated. Most of the time, churches will be glad to answer too. I find that the most resistance comes when you question the answers though.
I wonder what it would look like if there were environments that allowed tough questions to be asked. I also wonder what it would look like for our peers to be comfortable in uncertainty with some tough issues. I know I am very uncomfortable with uncertainty. Are we able to live with this?
I do know this. There is a culture out there that is no longer satisfied with pat answers and proofs. Are we willing to journey with them in uncharted waters as we seek to make since of these changing times? I think it will be something that we will have to do if we are to be relevant to today's culture.
I do know this. There is a culture out there that is no longer satisfied with pat answers and proofs. Are we willing to journey with them in uncharted waters as we seek to make since of these changing times? I think it will be something that we will have to do if we are to be relevant to today's culture.
Jesus himself seemed to use narratives and metaphors instead of propoisitonal truths and doctrinal bullet points. Jesus tells us to knock, seek, and ask. It seems that Jesus desires us to engage with Him through questions and conversation. I wonder if this is what we need to breed confidence in uncertainty. I think its time that, like Jesus, that the church allow for this type of engagement, and may we find ways to allow this sort of environment to emerge.
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